Hair Venting >__< and considering a texturizer

So, I believe I have 4Z hair, b/c NO matter what I do to my hair it kinks, coils and napps and EATS grease. NOTHING seems to make it softer. And my only alternative is to relax or texturize. It's very frustrating to me and although I've only been natural for about 2 months and transitioned for 7, I'm just done right now. My mom is convincing me to texturize. And I CAN NOT have the pretty, FLAWLESS,UN-DRY, Moisturized natural type 4 hair or whatever, because no matter what I do my hair does not take. I went to the salon today and got a hair color that I HATE, the beautician couldn't even straighten my hair. She keep combing my hair with a rat tail, DRY, and keep convincing me to texturize. I even think I have heat damage now since she used a TON and I mean a lot and my hair still is not even straight. I posted a forum about a week ago and only one person responded as to an alternative to my EXTREME dry, nappy, coily, and kinky hair. LOL I do not think anyone I mean ANYONE has the texture similar not even close to the hair I have. And I think even someone with this texture would opp to get a texturizer because it is available. I feel alone, and since there is an alternative to straighten my hair chemically, then i may as well.

it just suckssss

When you first big chop, you will experience dryness. Now that you will colored your hair, you will experience even more dryness.

What products have to been using on your hair?

Did you try co washing several days a week? That helped a lot when I first BC.

Oil rinses helped too. I would wet my hair first, then I would apply EVOO, then apply my conditioner on top of the and co wash as usual.

if you think you need a relaxer or texturizer, get it. relaxing or texturizing doesn't mean all of your hair issues will magically disappear. your hair may still be dry. before i resorted to that (especially after transitioning for 7 months), i'd try to dig a little deeper.

sometimes the products we use can contribute greatly to dryness. this is how i found out i can't do silicones. silicones make my hair dry as a bone. look at the ingredients of the products you use. keep a hair diary. try to use one product at a time and see what your end result is with that product. you may be protein sensitive. i can only use coconut oil if it's part of a water based moisturizer. only you can isolate your problem and try to figure it out. others may chime in with what works for them but that doesn't necessarily means it will work for you.

also, you should stalk youtube and fotki. look for people who have hair similar to yours.

i'm sorry to hear about your hair color experience. i wish you well.

daily co-washing became my BFF after my BC.

ingredients for infusium 23 leave in conditioner //
Water, Amodimethicone, PEG 40 Hydrogenated Castor Extract, Panthenol,
Cetrimonium Chloride, PEG/PPG 18/18 Dimethicone, Polyquaternium 11,
Citric Acid, Betaine, Glycerin, Sorbitol, Trideceth 12, PPG 2 Methyl
Ether, Serine, Glycine, Glutamic Acid, Arginine, Threonine, Lysine,
Alanine, Proline, Hydroxyethyl Cellulose, PEG 8/SMDI Copolymer, Behenic
Acid, Palmitoyl Myristyl Serinate, Oleic Acid, Palmitic Acid, Linoleic
Acid, Stearic Acid, Arachidic Acid, PEG 8, Polysorbate 80, Aminomethyl
Propanol, Fragrance, Sodium PCA, Methylparaben, DMDM Hydantoin, Disodium
EDTA


the bolded are water soluble silicones that can be washed out with co-washing or a mild surfactant based shampoo. however, they can still be a contributor to dryness. some people experience dryness from polyquats. polysorbate is a surfactant/emulsifier. i found out polysorbate makes my hair dry as does coco-betaine. again, it's all trial and error. this is where a hair diary comes in handy.

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after co-washing my hair, i apply a silicone free conditioner (as my leave in) and raw shea butter to seal in the moisture. i let my hair hair dry. if you can't use shea butter, you can use any oil that your hair likes as a sealant. you can buy olive, soybean and canola at your grocery store. they are inexpensive and great for oil rinses too.

you don't have to pay an arm and leg for great products. do you have a trader joe near you? they make excellent hair products @ super reasonable prices. have you heard of natures gate and/or V05 moisture milks? they make silicone free conditioners and are sold at most grocery stores, wholefoods (natures gate), target... ulta sells inecto conditioner.

other silicone free conditioners available at your local drugstore/target/walmart/beauty supply : david babaii for wildaid, samy esencia, giovanni, tigi moisture maniac, tigi bedhead oatmeal honey, elasta qp intense conditioner

try to do a google search for some sort of government map that describes water. try to find out if you have hard or soft water in your area. if you have hard water, maybe it is putting too many minerals in your hair. i've heard you can try washing hair with bottled water or water you filter, or installing a shower filter on your shower head, if you can't use it straight out of the tap.

nine months is almost a year, i don't think i'd give up after that long.

I used to use infusium shampoo and it made my hair really hard and it felt like straw so idk maybe the infusium could have something to do with it? Have you tried giovanni products?

Well I'm kind of in your shoes. My last relaxer was at the end of June last year and BC in Feb. Detangling and combing is so difficult but I'm trying to make it one year for this June.

I am sorry that you are having a hard time.I really do think that you should consider what happycurlysaid about checking to see if yourwater is too hard and if so get a shower filter.I also think you need to try some different products.I think you should cowash your hair more often and then seal with an oil.maybe you need to moisturize your hair throughout the day as well with some kind of moisturizing spritz.Dont give up you just need to find out what works for your hair.Its not easy a lot of trial and error, I wish you the best.

Grease most grease contain petroleum/mineral oil which esp if applied on dry hair can prevent any moisture from getting in
Hair color atleast for now b/c u need to learn ur hair and get a regimen first after recently BCing plus the usuall dryness that occurs after and color treated hair needs extra attention and care anyways
&heat damage


Infusium 23 is very liquidy, u might need something creamier/thicker. Also the original one (aka repairologie) has protein in and some ppl are protein sensitive and it makes their hair feel dry/hard/like straw.
I cant really tell w/o a pic but I think Juices n Berries my have similar hair to u and she is a beast with the styles lol. Check out her Curl Street Journal.
Deep Conditioning might help, as well as co-washing more often. Also baggying at night (moisturizing/sealing and then covering with a plastic cap or grocery bag underneath ur satin scarf/bonnet) ur hair should be noticeably softer and moisturized in the morning. Also idk how u moisturize/seal but u should use a water/liquid based moisturizer----->seal with an oil ----->creamy moisturizer on top. Good luck & hope that helps. I really don’t think relaxing/texturizing should be an option right now, ESPECIALLY since u already have chemicals (color) in ur hair. u don’t wanna overdo it and seriously damage your hair more

Nessa101 wrote:I used to use infusium shampoo and it made my hair really hard and it felt like straw so idk maybe the infusium could have something to do with it? Have you tried giovanni products?

Infusium tore my hair up. It made my hair dry as a bone and my ends split if you looked at them. It ewas a hot mess. Even though it took like 3 minutes to put that leave-in conditioner in my hair, it took about 3 months to get my hair back healthy. My hair was dry, straw-like and snapped. Ugh

do u have anyway to take a pic of ur hair? (u dont have to show ur face if u dont wanna) it would just help us to give u better suggestions if we could see what it looks like

I'm really new at this, only 4 months transitioning, so all I can give is my brief experience. I must admit I always had dry hair until now. I now co-wash with cone free conditioner every three days and wash with a sulfate free shampoo once a week. I deep condition under a hooded dryer once a week. I use a water based moisturizer and seal my ends with olive oil. I have also started bagging once a week with olive oil. The frequent washing has made such a difference in my hair. I used to wash every two weeks and my hair always broke off and was dry. Now my hair is much softer and more manageable. I also moisturize 2-3 times a day. If it's dry I just add more of my water based moisturizer. From what I have learned grease is not good for our hair as the other ladies have shared.


Please remember that no hair is flawless but you can have beautiful hair. God made your natural hair beautiful and He doesn't make mistakes. It's just going to take time to learn how to take care of your hair. Stay encouraged. We're here for you!

Thanks so much for recommending me Iri. I'm just working with what I've got. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] And I think that's probably the thing you're going to have to learn Music as well. This texture is on your head not by mistake. And just because you have a thick coarse texture does not mean your hair is unmanageable in it's natural state. Everyone hair type has it's challenges. To be honest, having natural hair is trial and error for most of us, as we have not worn our hair in it's natural state for the majority of our lives. I have 4b (there's no such thing as 4z lol) hair and I LOVE it. There are a variety of styling options even with this hair type.

Two reasons why I don't think you should texturize:

1. If you have 4b hair or hair without a curl pattern, getting a texturizer will NOT make your hair curly. Texturizers loosen the curl in your hair. If there is no curl to loosen, all it will do is make your hair straight. The only way to get curly hair is to get a curly perm or a jherri curl [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

2. You said yourself that even when you had a relaxer your hair was dry. So getting another chemical process, especially on your ends where hair is usually most dry will only make the problem worse.


My hair was also dry when I first BCed. I am just now getting the moisture thing down. Here is what I do. There are 3 steps as recommended by Chicoro in her book Grow It.

Water Based Leave In (Kinky Curly Knot Today, Oyin Honey Hemp Condish, etc)
Oil (EVOO, EVCO, castor, whichever your prefer)
Creamy Moisturizer (shea butter mix, Qhemet Amla Olive Heavy Cream or Burdock Root Butter Cream, Oyin Whipped Pudding, etc.)

I am finding that no matter what products I use, if I use them in that order, my hair is moisturized.

And like the others have already stated, if dryness is your issue you should definitely stay away from sulfates and cones, and even more so absolutely NO mineral oil or petrolatum. Those products block moisture from getting into your hair. They work by coating the hair shaft, which isn't bad, but it isn't going to help your hair. Oils like coconut oil can actually penetrate the hair shaft. Jojoba oil is good for the scalp because it is similar to the oils naturally produced. I've found castor to be the one that is most softening. As for the ater based leave in, I make a spritz using the Knot Today. The recipe is in my CSJ thread. I am a product junkie so I experiment with different creamy products but the ones I've listed have worked fine thus far.


Please don't be discouraged. I would definitely recommend you check out my Curl Street Journal Thread as well as my old Butters N Bars Thread posted in my signature. I have come a long way, but I think there will be some valuable information in them to help you.

And if you have any questions don't hesitate to send me a private message.

P.S. If you could post some pictures of your hair it might help us to better assess the situation. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Remember also that what you put into your hair isn't as nearly important as to what you're putting inside of your body. Do you drink enough water? How's you're overall diet? Are you taking any vitamins? Water is great for our hair but also works wonders in our body and it shows inside out!

I agree with everyone else with ideas such as keeping a hair journal to document what your hair likes and what it dislike but in order to keep a journal you'll have to start reading and weeding! Read the ingredients carefully and then start weeding out certain products from your stash. If something doesn't work for your hair then you can always do a swap; don't subject your hair to torture by using a product that sucks for you're hair type.

Make sure you're hair is tied up with a satin bonnet or a satin pillowcase and if need be have a bottle of your water with oil(s) of your choice to use throughout the day when your hair looks or feels dry. I don't know much about anything but we're all here to learn together so I HTH [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

you all are soooo awesome. thank you all for the advice... I'm defintely taking steps towards softer and moisturized hair. I have pics of my hair and as you can tell I am in the type 4 category. I used my webcam to take this and the lighting and quality isnt the best but I hope you all can get an idea. As you can see my hair is dry, I hadn't moisturized since the morning but.. that is how my hair looks 24-7. Literally as I moisturize my hair, it soaks it right up. But I'm gonna put my hair back in twist this weekend. I don't really wear my fro out often.




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i see some curlies up in that head! , you just need a better moisturizing routine and you should see obvious changes in your hair soon ...

I totally agree! I think some of the products you have you should stop using and you need to figure out the order to put things into your hair to make it moisturized. Also, you have the PERFECT hair for twisting! I think your hair is lovely and if you did some twists with possibly Organic Root Stimulator Lock and Twist Gel you would look FAB Or wear it like is in in the pic and rock and puff!! Your hair is great and I agree with iri there are definitely some curls in there! You have to love your hair though or else no one else will love it either. Confidence is key! Also like other said, after the BC your moisture level is most likely in the dumps. It takes a few months and lots of trial and error to fix the years of mistakes of putting chemicals and heat and harsh things in our hair.

And OMGeee why did that stylist try to comb your hair with a rattail comb DRY?! Is she crazy???? smh ... no one's hair needs to be combed with a rattail comb dry

@bhomles87 I have been going to her for the past two or so years but I was relaxed. I hadnt been to her in 8 months and, she did put the color in but did not have the tools to straighten my hair. She couldnt even get a brush throught it! But I felt so out of place , she was nice, she didnt even charged me the the full because I think she knew I wasn't happy. But yea, she didn't have a straightening comb and she was using a rat tail comb while my hair was dry, and then using a flat iron. LOL my hair did not stay straight for nothing.

But I do LOVE my hair and I have gained even more confidence by just accepting the what i was born with. I was just upset and I felt alone between my mom agreeing with the beautician about getting a texturizer and her combing my hair with a rat tail comb lol.But she was really nice about it though...

That makes sense. You just want your family to love your natural hair like you do! So it's hard to hear them saying you should get a relaxer when you know there's nothing wrong with your hair.

iri9109 wrote:i see some curlies up in that head! , you just need a better moisturizing routine and you should see obvious changes in your hair soon ...

I agree. I see the curls too. I think once you get your hair well moisturized your texture will become more apparent. Also, what does your hair look like when wet? That can be an indicator of how your hair looks when properly moisturized.