about to give up

My last relaxer was October 3, 2009. Since then I've been transitioning or trying to, but I am becoming very discouraged. I really don't know what to do with my hair.

My hair is beyond dry...it's brittle....when I comb it, it's in the sink, on the couch, in my room, on the floor it's everywhere. I don't understand. I've tried aphogee, i've tried v05, I've tried olive oil, the avocoda conditioner, mixing honey in my conditioner, tea trea oikl, shea butter and coconut oil mix, coconut oil alone, ecostyler gel, dr. bronners, Giovanni TTT conditoner, HE Hydralicious, Suave Naturals Rosemary Mint, cholesterol, and recently infusium 23..I mean I've tried it all...and I've spent way too much money on stuff that I don't think works at all! I need help.

I have 4b hair, that was once thick. I've been diagnosed with psorarsis on the scalp, (but that's kinda under control) I try not to scratch at it. But my temples are always itching, (guess that's why they're thin) My ends are so scraggly and thin, like see through, new growth, about 3 inches, and thick, and really dry. Hair 'looks' brittle, and might break if you look at it too long...


so could someone tell me what i'm doing wrong?

Tisee, I don't know what you're doing wrong, but don't give up! I know it seems so much easier, but you've come this far!

Are you sure the psorarsis has nothing to do with your scalp/hair issues?? Perhaps you can try some protective styling? What do you DC your hair with?

I'm just asking so if others visit the forum, they may be able to offer more ideas.

Let us know your routine so we can try and help. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Dont give up...How long do you plan to transition? Do you think you are ready for the BC? Your hair will react different once you are 100% natural.

What kind of styles have you been trying?

I'm a 4b and had your same exact issue when I 1st started transitioning. You mentioned the products you've used, but how are you styling your hair? Are you protective styling?

Don't give up! It would be so easy to. I can't count how many times I've considered getting a perm because my natural hair was too hard to deal with, but it's all about finding a routine that works for you. I've tried so many different products that people were saying they loved and they completely didn't work for me. Since your still transitioning have you considered cutting off the relaxed ends? or doing the BC? You'll learn more about the products that work for you once you are completely natural. Also doing protective styles will really help while your transitioning. HTH!

Do not give up hun. I felt the same way you did in September, but I decided to BC so there will be no turning back. I hope it all works out for you. Just keep trying new styles and try Castor oil, It is heavy and it is not as easy for your hair to drink it up.

I agree with the others. Please don't give up. I have 4b hair as well. Transitioning for us can be stressful. When I was transitioning, I went to a natural stylist, and she said that it would be normal for the hair to shed. Because there is such a difference between the texture of relaxed hair and 4b hair, the relaxed hair is too weak to hold on and it eventually just breaks off. As for moisture, it may be a good idea to look at your routine. Most use this method of moisturizing as recommended in Chicoro's book Grow It:

1. Use a water based leave in (leave in conditioner, aloe vera/glycerin)
2. Seal with an Oil (coconut, castor, olive, etc.)
3. Apply a creamy moisturizer (shea butter mix, etc)

I recently learned this and my hair is so much softer and holds in the moisture.

I think what you really need to do is find a routine that works for you and don't just try everything that everyone recommends because it may not work for you. It seems like you've gone through all the products "most naturals" use, but at the end of the day, you have to do what you need to do for your hair.

And like I stated earlier, it may just be time to BC. Once you do, you will be able to learn how to better care for your hair in it's natural state without the hassle of the two textures.

HTH.

Also, I see quite a few proteins in your reggie. It is possible that you are protein sensitive. Many people report that the use of proteins makes their hair dry and brittle. That's something else to consider.

Hang in there and remember natural hair is beautiful; however, it takes a lot of work and patience.

You have been given a lot of good advice...also, JnB has provided you with suggestions that you can try and tweak to work with your hair.

It will be so worth it in the end....going natural that is.

my last relaxer was around the same time as yours... april 7, i decided to BC primarily because it was getting a little difficult to handle the 2 textures... one plays against the others almost like being in a struggle to survive.... one thing that helped was moisturizing the new growth and braiding or twisting every night.

I'm not sure if my psorarsis has anything to do with the breakage or dry hair, I only use the prescription shampoo, maybe once a week. I just used it this last week, and it had been almost a month. It's not really drying. I just try to follow up with a good conditioner afterwards. I only put it on my scalp though, it makes suds without water.

Styles that I've been doing--I just learned to two strand flat twist, some days I wear it in like 4 big ones in a curvy style straight back. I tried Bantu knots, they don't work for me, and I've tried the twist-n-curl, and it works, but I can never get past second day hair, so I felt I was touching my hair too much, so I haven't done one in a few weeks. Now, I have it in a ponytail, with the ends tucked.

To deep condition, I use that avocado deep conditioner, a conditoner like yes to carrots with olive oil mix in and 20 minutes of heat, or ORS replenishing pak 20 minutes with heat (smells so good)

I am so not ready for the BC...do you see my avatar, do you see my head...it's huge. I just can't imagine it. Can you?

Since I've been transitioning, I've been cutting y hair every other month. at least half inch, this last time I cut 2.5-3 inches off. My hair is about the same length, ends just are horrific. Terrible. And my poor, poor edges...I scratch in the same spot :/

Ladies thanks for all of the encouragment and suggestions!

I do have a couple of questions @Juices-n-berries what are some good water based leave in's and moisturizers. Price really isn't an issue, if it works, i'll buy it. What type of castor oil is good? JBCO?
and I have a shea mix (shea, coconut oil) It seems too thick and when I use a lil it makes my hair sticky and greasy to me.

Thanks!!!

I'm not sure if my psorarsis has anything to do with the breakage or dry hair, I only use the prescription shampoo, maybe once a week. I just used it this last week, and it had been almost a month. It's not really drying. I just try to follow up with a good conditioner afterwards. I only put it on my scalp though, it makes suds without water.

Styles that I've been doing--I just learned to two strand flat twist, some days I wear it in like 4 big ones in a curvy style straight back. I tried Bantu knots, they don't work for me, and I've tried the twist-n-curl, and it works, but I can never get past second day hair, so I felt I was touching my hair too much, so I haven't done one in a few weeks. Now, I have it in a ponytail, with the ends tucked.

To deep condition, I use that avocado deep conditioner, a conditoner like yes to carrots with olive oil mix in and 20 minutes of heat, or ORS replenishing pak 20 minutes with heat (smells so good)

I am so not ready for the BC...do you see my avatar, do you see my head...it's huge. I just can't imagine it. Can you?

Since I've been transitioning, I've been cutting y hair every other month. at least half inch, this last time I cut 2.5-3 inches off. My hair is about the same length, ends just are horrific. Terrible. And my poor, poor edges...I scratch in the same spot :/

Ladies thanks for all of the encouragment and suggestions!

I do have a couple of questions @Juices-n-berries what are some good water based leave in's and moisturizers. Price really isn't an issue, if it works, i'll buy it. What type of castor oil is good? JBCO?
and I have a shea mix (shea, coconut oil) It seems too thick and when I use a lil it makes my hair sticky and greasy to me.

Thanks!!!

I'm not sure if my psorarsis has anything to do with the breakage or dry hair, I only use the prescription shampoo, maybe once a week. I just used it this last week, and it had been almost a month. It's not really drying. I just try to follow up with a good conditioner afterwards. I only put it on my scalp though, it makes suds without water.

Styles that I've been doing--I just learned to two strand flat twist, some days I wear it in like 4 big ones in a curvy style straight back. I tried Bantu knots, they don't work for me, and I've tried the twist-n-curl, and it works, but I can never get past second day hair, so I felt I was touching my hair too much, so I haven't done one in a few weeks. Now, I have it in a ponytail, with the ends tucked.

To deep condition, I use that avocado deep conditioner, a conditoner like yes to carrots with olive oil mix in and 20 minutes of heat, or ORS replenishing pak 20 minutes with heat (smells so good)

I am so not ready for the BC...do you see my avatar, do you see my head...it's huge. I just can't imagine it. Can you?

Since I've been transitioning, I've been cutting y hair every other month. at least half inch, this last time I cut 2.5-3 inches off. My hair is about the same length, ends just are horrific. Terrible. And my poor, poor edges...I scratch in the same spot :/

Ladies thanks for all of the encouragment and suggestions!

I do have a couple of questions @Juices-n-berries what are some good water based leave in's and moisturizers. Price really isn't an issue, if it works, i'll buy it. What type of castor oil is good? JBCO?
and I have a shea mix (shea, coconut oil) It seems too thick and when I use a lil it makes my hair sticky and greasy to me.

Thanks!!!

TiseeBabee wrote:I'm not sure if my psorarsis has anything to do with the breakage or dry hair, I only use the prescription shampoo, maybe once a week. I just used it this last week, and it had been almost a month. It's not really drying. I just try to follow up with a good conditioner afterwards. I only put it on my scalp though, it makes suds without water.

Styles that I've been doing--I just learned to two strand flat twist, some days I wear it in like 4 big ones in a curvy style straight back. I tried Bantu knots, they don't work for me, and I've tried the twist-n-curl, and it works, but I can never get past second day hair, so I felt I was touching my hair too much, so I haven't done one in a few weeks. Now, I have it in a ponytail, with the ends tucked.

To deep condition, I use that avocado deep conditioner, a conditoner like yes to carrots with olive oil mix in and 20 minutes of heat, or ORS replenishing pak 20 minutes with heat (smells so good)

I am so not ready for the BC...do you see my avatar, do you see my head...it's huge. I just can't imagine it. Can you?

Since I've been transitioning, I've been cutting y hair every other month. at least half inch, this last time I cut 2.5-3 inches off. My hair is about the same length, ends just are horrific. Terrible. And my poor, poor edges...I scratch in the same spot :/

Ladies thanks for all of the encouragment and suggestions!

I do have a couple of questions @Juices-n-berries what are some good water based leave in's and moisturizers. Price really isn't an issue, if it works, i'll buy it. What type of castor oil is good? JBCO?
and I have a shea mix (shea, coconut oil) It seems too thick and when I use a lil it makes my hair sticky and greasy to me.

Thanks!!!

*I* can. All that hair is covering up your face. A short cut will bring out those cheekbones and we can see your face more. Meaning, we can see YOU, more.

You also may want to go a little lighter with shea mixes (or ANY butter-based mix). Get heavy handed and you WILL get a sticky, greasy mess. Less is definitely more.

Juices-n-Berries wrote:

1. Use a water based leave in (leave in conditioner, aloe vera/glycerin)
2. Seal with an Oil (coconut, castor, olive, etc.)
3. Apply a creamy moisturizer (shea butter mix, etc)

JNB, this method is FOR REAL. I never even read Chicoro's book...I was just doing it because I'm in the Castor Oil Challenge. Not only is my hair softer, it's more DEFINED too so I don't really need to lean on the Afroveda PWG or the KCCC. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

DO NOT GIVE UP. I just BC last Sat and I hated my hair. If you can find my thread (BC Finally) you will see where I hated the way I looked. But I must admit my hair feels great. I have been conditioning and moisturizing all week. I even wore a wig the first two days. I think you will look fine with short hair . The support here is wonderful. My last relaxer was Sept 09. I transitioned with a sew in weave but I really took care of my hair, washed and conditioned weekly, applied Jojoba oil to my scalp, and wild growth oil to my edges. If you will not BC, have you thought about BC and wearing a sew in(not glue) until you are ready. Just don't get a perm. We are in this together. I also have a mixture of 4a 4b hair that is really thick.

Jnb-Your hair has really been an inspiration to me . My hair is really thick like yours.

TiseeBabee,

Please don't give up. I too have been there. My last relaxer was 8/7/09. This past winter was ROUGH. My hair was/is short and I had/have to co-wash or wet almost everyday. I must say that things really changed for me once I began to use HE Hello Hydration and HE Totally Twisted. These two have helped me to restore moisture to my hair with a capitol M. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] For me TT is a little more moisturizing but, I prefer the smell of HH so I alternate. I tried doing the conditioner only method and found that my scalp (and maybe even my hair) needs shampoo. I found two more good friends in Aveda Damage Remedy poo and condish. This after I have a bathroom full of products that could fill a small beauty supply store. LOL. You may notice that most of the products I use have "cones". Guess my hair likes them b/c when I tried to ditch them things did not go so well.

Juices and Berries' advice is very, very good. Castor and olive oil have become BEST friends. LOL.

Anyhoo, I say all of this to say that it is trial and error to find the right product mix but, I would suggest starting with JNB's advice. Hang in there. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Please don't give up! Maybe you should stop trying so many different products. It's easy to get wrapped up in the quest for some miracle product but less is definitely better sometimes. Try to keep it simple. Get yourself a moisturizing shampoo, a deep conditioner, a rinse out conditioner, and a moisturizing product. Find a staple hair style to get you through the frustrating phase you're going through. I thought about quitting so many times and I'm relieved that I didn't. Try black tea rinses for your shedding. And of course try as little manipulation as possible. Keep pressure off of your edges and try castor oil (I haven't done it personally but I'm going to because my edges are thinning as well). The regimen Juices-N-Berries posted is right on! Keep it simple. When you are finally ready to make the big chop, it will make a huge difference

don't give up!!!!!!! if you have psoriasis, the perm will in no time make ur condition worse!!!! i agree with everyone that responded, except with the comment of protein sensitivity...if you deep condish with a protein conditioner, then follow up with a super duper deep condish that promotes moisture and softer hair. also keep in mind the stronger your hair is, the fewer times you need to deep condition with protein.

oh, and please, please, please don't comb your hair dry!!! especially since you have two different textures...this will further magnify your problem. but maybe it is time for your to BC....

do you deep condition?? you can see a BIG difference when you deep condition.

by any chance, could you post the ingredients in your medicated shampoo?? i am quite curious there is something in there that is drying your hair out.


i can tell you that i SEVERE (so severe that most people don't recognize me now) acne in college and i tried everything on the prescription market to treat it. i was such a regular at the dermatologist that they knew me by first name. i took a leap of faith n tried proactiv(dec 2004)....and haven't looked back since. this is the same approach i used when dealing with a serious fungal infection on my scalp that literally left me with no hair (maybe only an inch of at most) on the back of my hair (and is why i have more hair on the top of my hair than on the back): i didn't bother going to the dermatologist for fear that that shampoo will dry out and make my hair break. i used my scientific expertise to treat myself. what is the moral of what i just said? try to find the remedy yourself, and part of your research comes from bringing this question to us...ur support system. so, kudos to you for coming to us!!

Don't give up! Please keep in mind that a perm is not the cure all. If your hair was dry before the perm, its going to be even worse after it because if you can't take care of your hair now, chemically altering it takes more dilgence.

Maybe you shouldn't try to many products. Find out what your hair likes and stick to it. You sound like you need to just start off with a clean slate.

Prepoo 1st- Soak your hair in some kind of oil. Olive oil, coconut oil, whatever oil your hair likes. Detangle it and braid it into 4 sections.

Clarify 2nd - Clarify with a clarifying shampoo to get rid of any product build up you may have. Clarify it really well.

Correct your porosity 3rd- I bet you any money that you probably haven't tried this. I bet your hair drinks in moisture but is never satisfied. That's because your porosity is off meaning your hair cuticle is open. I use Porosity Correction Conditioner to correct this and my hair has never been more moisturized. You can use that or apple cider vinager.

Deep Condition 4th- I know for my hair, shea butter SAVED my hair in the winter because that weather was murdering my hair! But i mixed olive oil and shea butter together and DC'd overnight. I rinsed the next morning

Moisturize and Seal 5th- Make sure you don't skip this step. Find a good moisturizer as i am sure these ladies can reccommend something to you and you can use an oil to seal.

Protective Style 6th- This is whats going to nurse your hair back to health. You need to do this right now while your taking care of it. Whether you get braids, kinky twist, sew-ins, sengleases twists, whatever just find somethinng to keep you away from your hair and IT out of your hands, your mind, and away from the perm kit.

Hope this helps!

@dajewel, I'm going to have to look up the ingedients...I use Clobex,(Active Ingreditents: CLOBETASOL PROPIONATE)
(Inactive ingredients: ALCOHOL, [td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"][/td][tr class=formTableRow itxtvisited="1"][td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"]CITRIC ACID MONOHYDRATE[/td][td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"],[/td][/tr]WATER, [tr class=formTableRow itxtvisited="1"][td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"]SODIUM CITRATE, [/td][td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"][/td][/tr][tr class=formTableRowAlt itxtvisited="1"][td class=formItem itxtvisited="1"]SODIUM LAURETH SULFATE[/td][/tr]

I have some foam called Olux-E (Each gram of Olux-E Foam contains 0.5 mg clobetasol propionate, USP. The foam also contains anhydrous citric acid USP, cetyl alcohol NF, cyclomethicone NF, isopropyl myristate NF, light mineral oil NF, polyoxyl 20 cetostearyl ether NF, potassium citrate monohydrate USP, propylene glycol USP, purified water USP, sorbitan monolaurate NF, white petrolatum USP, and phenoxyethanol NF as a preservative. )

Very strong steriods are in these products, so everytime I used them, I cringe a little bit. I'm still not sure how I have psoriasis, I did move from NC to Missouri (but I was here almost 1.5 years before it sufaced) and no one in my family has it. They say it's about genetics, so I don't know. What would you recommend? and I've tried Tea Tree, it made my head itch to no endm tried 'greasing' the scalp with olive oil and EVCO...still itches, and flakes.

I only comb hair when wet, when dry it's just not going to work.

I'm going to look into the black tea rinses, and also some porosity correction conditioners, any suggestions. Keep in mind that I only have a sally's, target, and walmart nearby in this little hick town. lol.

I agree with Mika. I think you will look gorgeous with a BC! Most of us do, regardless of head shape or size. But I can understand if you're not ready.

Some water based leave ins I use are:

Kinky Curly Knot Today
Oyin Honey Hemp Conditioner
Oyin Juices and Berries

But there are many others both in store and online that you can try. Just make sure the main ingredient is water.

As far as the shea butter, because most of your hair is relaxed, it is probably too thick for you hair. Even curlies with natural type 3 hair sometimes report shea butter mixes as leaving their hair greasy. So I can only imagine what it's looking like on your relaxed hair. Perhaps you should try something lighter. Or compose your mix differently to contain less shea butter.

As for the tea tree oil. I hope you were not using it directly on your scalp. Essential oils (tea tree, peppermint, rosemary, etc) should be diluted in a carrier oil (olive, castor, jojoba)

The medicated shampoo you are using has a sulfate. That can be drying to the hair as well. If you need to continue using it, make sure you up your deep conditioners.

Dajawel is right. Protein isn't bad for the hair. But if you use it, you should follow with a moisturizing treatment. Some curlies alternate per week. One week protein, next week moisture. I don't have this pattern down yet, but I'm working on it.

I've heard JBCO is best, but I know many people use the regular kind from Whole Foods with good results.

I also agree with Delta87. If this is all too much, perhaps you should consider braids, kinky twists, or a weave to make your transition a bit easier.

Any other questions, feel free to ask.

Hi TiseeBabee, I have the same condition and use the same shampoo. I still have to use Clobex twice a week. I also still have to occasionally use Derma-smooth (this one contains fig or somekind of natural oil + steriods).

I transitioned for a little longer than where you are now. I can tell you, every relaxer made it worse. Horribly worse. I have had psoriasis for years and for the first few days after a touchup my hair would be ok (except for the sores on my scalp) but about a week later my scalp would turn white and my parts would look huge. My hair would fall out in patches, then handfuls. I thought I was going to be bald. Because my hair was shoulder length,my family, friends and a couple of doctors would look and assume that because I had hair I was over-reacting. I finally ran into the right doctor and they put me on the meds. But the relaxers did a lot of damage.

When I stopped relaxing it took 2 months before my hair started to fill in and about 3 or 4 months before the scab hair grew out. Cutting the relaxed hair off was the best hair day I EVER had!

To be honest, I also don't think the Clobex made my hair dry, it was that the hair growing out of my scalp was abnormal and once relaxed, was just breakage waiting to happen. That and the combination of sulfates in my shampoos did my hair in. I switched to sulfate free shampoos, co-washing, and deep moisturizing conditioners and no cones, no hairspray and no heat. My hair still broke and still wouldn't always hold a style.

I would seriously consider getting the big chop. I would also recommend the books like Chicoro's and Going Natural.

If you want to keep transitioning for awhile, since your hair is probably pretty thin at the ends (and thicker at the roots) you will have problems holding T&Cs. Just retwist on damp hair every other day and continue not to touch. You have a lot of great advice in the posts above so I would definitely implement their suggestions.

AND your head is NOT too big. You are really cute and I bet you would look amazing with a TWA. AT 7 months your hair may already be 3 inches so you wouldn't be starting from scratch.

Good luck and keep posting!

i agree with juices n berries and swoodward!! they hit it on the nail about sulfate in the shampoo. if you must use the psoriasis shampoo, i suggest mixing in a condish that has no silicones, as this will mitigate the effects of the sulfate in the shampoo. also, the labeling has "alcohol"? this labeling is misleading because there is literally hundreds of "alcohols". so, i don't know if the alcohol is a fatty alcohol (an alcohol that is good for the hair), alcohol that is a humectant or an alcohol that is simply drying to your hair.